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View Full Version : ROTFLMAO! Poaching!


Pete Walen
23-04-07, 02:10 PM
Yes indeed! There is a pipe band that has brought in a known snare drummer and his buddies...

Anyway - we had a few younger pipers who left the band recently with extremely similar reasons for leaving. Last band practice one of the more experienced pipers walked in with a printed email he'd received... come on by, check out a practice...

Having had subtle hints from the PM of that band that "any time I wanted to head over, there was a spot waiting for me (no thanks, I've done the "build a band" game three times now... 5 if you count rebuilding a band of the same name...)

Just had to share... Should I go complain somewhere? :rotf:

Scarlet O'Hair
23-04-07, 04:12 PM
Well....I'm told the complaint department is over there behind that tree. No, no, not that one, THAT one!

Pete Walen
23-04-07, 04:19 PM
This tree Scarlet?

What's that funny smell?

I was just struck at how amusing it was, given the vehemence of some of the comments regarding "poaching" and all on BDF. The stereotype there was "mean upper grade band stealing our players..." Here's a lower grade band letting players in an upper grade band know that if they get fed up, they can come by and play with them if they like it better.

Poached players? Nah, I still prefer broiled! Smoked is good too, over apple-wood. Lovely flavor... meat just crumbles away... fantastic. mmmmm... a little sauce - oh yeah... mmm (must be lunch time)

Robbie.Crow
23-04-07, 04:50 PM
Tell him if he moves me there ill play for him :bg:

BARR_R
23-04-07, 05:00 PM
Now see I PM'd you about this and I believe that what I said in there is true. At least all facts lead this way.

This kind of stuff just amazes me? People on public forums complaing about other bands asking their players to play in their band. I respect you Pete as a drummer, not just a bass but as a snare as well, but this is just driving me crazy. I think that the world (yeah I said it) the whole freaking world mainly the States is just waaaaaaaaaaaaaay to over sensitive. Parents can't spank their kids, people have to ALWAYS watch what they said or someone could be offended. I mean COME ON! If a PM asked you to play in his band, WHATS THE BIG FREAKING DEAL!!!!!!!!?!?!?!?!?!? Take it as a compliment Pete, some players would LOVED to be asked to play in a band. As far as the pipers go that left your band to join a different band, well maybe they were not happy in their current situation. If he brought an email saying "Come check out our band practice sometime" whats wrong with that? This is a freaking hobby? Who cares about weather its a lowergrade band or not. Does that make a difference?

I'll say this: I will ask ANY PLAYER at ANY TIME to come join the band I'm in. And no I was not the one who asked these players to leave their current band. What am I doing wrong? If you are a good player, I WANT YOU IN MY BAND! Period. If you decide to come GREAT! If not, fine we will have a beer and some laughs later. But by people asking, what is really the big deal?

Poaching.............................no such thing, lets move on!

Ryan Barr

Pete Walen
23-04-07, 06:18 PM
Ryan - I just found it amusing that with the addition of a few higher-grade players and shifting around that results from that, a band that would typically be the "source" for players to be "recruited" is suddenly in the role of "poacher." I do wonder how the "poaching police" on BDF would respond.

Considering I've been "recruited away" from bands, and have been called a "poacher" in the past, I find all those matches to be amusing...

"Recruited" Scenario: "Man, you can play rings around most of the guys they have - you gotta check 'em out."

"Poaching" Scenario: Drummer1 - "Got any plans for the weekend?"
Me - "Work in the yard Saturday, Sunday I'm going to pipe band practice."
Drummer1 - "Hey, can I ride along and check it out too?"
Drummer2 - "That sounds fun, got room for one more?"
Yup... drummer 1 and drummer 2 both joined... made me a poacher I guess...

Scotty_Ballylough
23-04-07, 06:21 PM
Now see I PM'd you about this and I believe that what I said in there is true. At least all facts lead this way.

This kind of stuff just amazes me? People on public forums complaing about other bands asking their players to play in their band. I respect you Pete as a drummer, not just a bass but as a snare as well, but this is just driving me crazy. I think that the world (yeah I said it) the whole freaking world mainly the States is just waaaaaaaaaaaaaay to over sensitive. Parents can't spank their kids, people have to ALWAYS watch what they said or someone could be offended. I mean COME ON! If a PM asked you to play in his band, WHATS THE BIG FREAKING DEAL!!!!!!!!?!?!?!?!?!? Take it as a compliment Pete, some players would LOVED to be asked to play in a band. As far as the pipers go that left your band to join a different band, well maybe they were not happy in their current situation. If he brought an email saying "Come check out our band practice sometime" whats wrong with that? This is a freaking hobby? Who cares about weather its a lowergrade band or not. Does that make a difference?

I'll say this: I will ask ANY PLAYER at ANY TIME to come join the band I'm in. And no I was not the one who asked these players to leave their current band. What am I doing wrong? If you are a good player, I WANT YOU IN MY BAND! Period. If you decide to come GREAT! If not, fine we will have a beer and some laughs later. But by people asking, what is really the big deal?

Poaching.............................no such thing, lets move on!

Ryan Barr

I hear ya buddy..........if only all of us thought like this..........this is possibly the most sensible thing i have ever read!

Werepiper
23-04-07, 06:31 PM
Poaching.............................no such thing, lets move on!

Ryan Barr

Nobody moves if they don't want to.
I am sure all those 'poached' individuals were forcibly led away and made to play with another band - bit like being press ganged. :rotf:

Bobby
23-04-07, 07:01 PM
Poaching.....recruiting......

a grey area term. In my mind, recruiting, is simply a directed invitation to join, or a blanket statement that the band is accepting new players.

Poaching, usually involves some kind of enticement being offered to specific potential players, effectively a bribe of some kind if you will, which can be usually found with negative comments about their current band and/or members while trying to "build up" the other band (we're so much better, we will be so much better, they're holding you back, they suck, you're too good for them, etc..etc..), and quite often entails appealing to their vanity to attract them.

Not everyone agrees with either scenario, but I don't recall anyone being forced into indentured servitude to a band. You join of your own accord and no one "owns" you. The choice is yours either way, but false promises and such are not usually found out until after the move.

dharron
23-04-07, 09:57 PM
...I'll say this: I will ask ANY PLAYER at ANY TIME to come join the band I'm in...
Since there is no chance whatsoever of me poaching or being poached way down here, I'll stay outa the main discussion, but Ryan, I burst out laughing when I read the line above. I would do exactly the same... if I had any to ask.

Never mind if they are good or not, so long as they are still breathing, walking and can hold an instrument.

rpeitzsch
24-04-07, 03:39 AM
Is it just me or does it seem that a few people are missing what Pete's laughing at?

To recap, previous complaints about poaching elsewhere have a higher grade band "stealing" players from lower grade bands.

Pete's laughing about this episode because now you have a lower grade band "stealing" players from a higher grade band, thus highlighting absurdity of the whole poaching situation.

CBarr
24-04-07, 04:13 AM
Yes indeed! There is a pipe band that has brought in a known snare drummer and his buddies...

Anyway - we had a few younger pipers who left the band recently with extremely similar reasons for leaving. Last band practice one of the more experienced pipers walked in with a printed email he'd received... come on by, check out a practice...

Having had subtle hints from the PM of that band that "any time I wanted to head over, there was a spot waiting for me (no thanks, I've done the "build a band" game three times now... 5 if you count rebuilding a band of the same name...)

Just had to share... Should I go complain somewhere? :rotf:



Rpeitzsch
Theres no sense in trying to lighten Petes post.
What I gather from his original post shown above, Pete seems upset a few players have left his band to play for another.
Yes, he does state the band plays in a lower grade (in his 2nd post)but Im pretty sure these players that have left are aware of this. Pete, of all people to bring this topic to the forums again when you know this topic's been beaten to a pulp shows me your upset by this.

Folks, this is a hobby in which we Do Not get paid for doing. Have fun, enjoy life and theres no sense in holding grudges towards people that may have asked some of your people to play elsewhere. Plus, you should take it as a compliment being they asked you and all.
News bulletin............People have a right in this world to make there own decisions. Noone can make anyone do anything you dont want to do.

Im with Ryan, lets move on.

C Barr

W Kemler
24-04-07, 02:58 PM
It's only your point of view Pete, that those players where poached. Maybe those players just simply wanted to do something different, maybe the band there going to suites there playing style and needs. Everyone has different reasons why they leave one band, to go to another. All of which are really none of anyones bussiness. Lets NEVER assume why people do what they do in this crazy world of bagpipes. It's all about cold beer, good music, and having fun.:vik:

Will


P.S. hey Chris and Ryan, will you come and play in my band? LOL

Stormy
24-04-07, 03:28 PM
This kind of stuff just amazes me?........I think that the world (yeah I said it) the whole freaking world mainly the States is just waaaaaaaaaaaaaay to over sensitive. Parents can't spank their kids, people have to ALWAYS watch what they said or someone could be offended. I mean COME ON!

Bloody Hell!!!! An American who thinks just like Stormy!!!!!!! The drinks are on me my friend!

:stormy: :red: :red:

Stormy
24-04-07, 03:36 PM
Poaching.....recruiting......In my mind, recruiting, is simply a directed invitation to join, or a blanket statement that the band is accepting new players.

Poaching, usually involves some kind of enticement being offered to specific potential players, effectively a bribe of some kind if you will......

I agree with you Bobby.
It's a sad day when a band cannot recruit members for fear of being accused of poaching.

Next time you are over I would like to invite you out for a drink but unfortunately cannot do so as someone may consider that I am "poaching" you and denying them a pint from Bobby!!!!!

:rotf:

PowerBoozer007
24-04-07, 07:36 PM
All modern pipe bands live in the moment, meaning there is no grand plan or future plan, just a dodgy hope that they'll have enough players to get to this year's Worlds and then we'll see what happens next year.

The dedicated and commited player is a thing of the past, it's a free agent system now. Some players are known to move to greener pasters at the drop of a hat and wear a different kilt every year, some are known to move only when the barn has burnt down and it's a real shock to see them in a different band.

Personally, I think there's too much of this instant band mentality where a band offers a trip and gains 6 or more players. it takes 3 to 5 years for a band to really gel together and be a real contender.

None of us can really say that we'll be in the same band 5 years from now as there's a lot of barn burning going on, but it would be nice to think there is a solid band that we can throw out the anchor and stay for awhile.

Best of luck to all in there search for that band!

Pete Walen
24-04-07, 07:59 PM
... given the vehemence of some of the comments regarding "poaching" and all on BDF. The stereotype there was "mean upper grade band stealing our players..." Here's a lower grade band letting players in an upper grade band know that if they get fed up, they can come by and play with them if they like it better.

... I just found it amusing that with the addition of a few higher-grade players and shifting around that results from that, a band that would typically be the "source" for players to be "recruited" is suddenly in the role of "poacher."

Why'd I start this thread? Because I was bemused at the situation. The "Borg" are suddenly having members assimilated by other bands...

I think some folks figure if they keep repeating that I'm upset and it will be true? Nope - still not upset. Amused, but not upset.

Kids (and adults) leave bands all the time - sometimes they find out that playing in a higher grade is harder than they thought. Sometimes they find out they are not as good as they thought they were - particularly if they move from a spot where they are among the better players to one where they are maybe not quite up to snuff. Perfectly natural for folks to bail before "its too late." Its also perfectly natural for folks to go back to where they were "before."

I do wonder how the "poaching police" on BDF would respond.

All the frantic comments made on BDF about how evil "poachers" are - and even having a post there bemoaning that parade bands could not get enough drummers to go around (in the area) because they'd all gone to The Borg - left me smiling and shaking my head at this. The "come to a practice and check us out" email fell into that category. A recruitment attempt. Not poaching.

I still intend to use it as a case-in-point the next time the "poaching" topic comes up over there... should be around 5 or 6 months or so. :rotf:

Maybe I should have used more smilies in the first post.... :whistle:

PowerBoozer007
02-05-07, 11:29 PM
The "come to a practice and check us out" email fell into that category. A recruitment attempt. Not poaching.


LOL, hell if that all it takes to get members into a band, I'll start spamming the piping globe right now!

We gave Robinson an all expense paid trip to California for a month, plus put $3000 in his pocket, set him up with a girlfriend and got him drunk every other night to get him to play with the band. Had I known it just took an Email, things could have been much easier! LOL

Drumming g33k
03-05-07, 12:21 AM
wow, you do spend a lot just to let a friend join a band...:tommy:

PowerBoozer007
03-05-07, 01:34 AM
The spending was no problem, setting him up with a girlfriend was nothing short of miraculous, he ain't exactly prettiest boy in the park. :gah: :rotf:

Bobby
03-05-07, 03:13 PM
The spending was no problem, setting him up with a girlfriend was nothing short of miraculous, he ain't exactly prettiest boy in the park. :gah: :rotf:

Now that's my kind of band....always thinking of the members.:rotf:

Dai Robb
03-05-07, 08:03 PM
You can keep the Girl Friend?/(Memeory is not that good anyway) but the money is interesting LOL

heatherbelle
03-05-07, 08:44 PM
'Poaching' sounds as if somebody somewhere's doing something deliberately sneaky and nasty. Is it not just that bands want to better themselves and have the best players they can in them, and to do that they need to ask good players to consider joining them. I would imagine that the word 'poach' might be used by the band that the good player decides to leave, as presumably the band that's left behind feels put out, bitter and angry at the player for leaving and at whoever asked them/approached them. Since band members are either grown adults with minds of their own, or children who have parents and tutors to look after them, I don't see why there should be a big problem with movement of people between bands. I would say what was more important was that individuals could get into a band where they can develop and learn, as well as feel comfortable etc, and when they reach a stage where that isn't happening, and the band shows no sign of changing in a way that would improve things, good for them if they can be open to making a change and respond to an invite from a band that might better provide what they need. This kind of movement will surely lead to a general development in the piping world and that seems to me a thing to be welcomed.:flowers:

W Kemler
04-05-07, 01:00 PM
I want to fly to Scotland and give you a hug:flowers: what you discribed is excactly what happened. The person **** **** **** didn't know if he was going to be able to compete this year do to lack of band members, his band had talks about taking the season off do to poor participation. He watched a couple of young pipers(very good pipers) leave. They left about a mounth ago to come play in the band I'm in, and as much as he would say he's not, he's mad about it, calling us poachers because of an email that read " stop by the band hall and check it out", and it wasen't even sent to the players who left. The person who is accusing us of being poachers because of and email forgets thats how he came to play in the band he's in, leaving a band to go play in another because of an email. Heatherbelle you once again have a well thought out point of view:beer:

Pete Walen
04-05-07, 01:05 PM
:rotf: :rotf: :rotf:

wjjagfan
09-05-07, 10:15 PM
When I haven't been happy with the band and have considered leaving, I've always felt a pang of guilt because my instructor is a big part of this band. That has kept me holding on and hoping for the best.

I think my patience/guilt has paid off as some recent changes hold out the promise of a much better future, but I've also discovered something else along the way. It doesn't hurt to get involved in the process even if it seems you have no voice and certainly no control. Bands don't want to lose members (for the most part) and who knows, they might make the changes you want especially if there are others who share you feelings.

I've mentioned the "poaching" word on this forum a couple of times but I tend now to believe there really is no such thing. If another band is more attractive for whatever reason, then go. I think you don't play as well when you harbor bad feelings so you're not doing your present band much good if you stay. You have to watch out for the "grass is greener" or "frying pan to fire" issues, but that's the chance you take and hopefully you don't burn too many bridges in the transition.

heatherbelle
09-05-07, 10:43 PM
, they might make the changes you want especially if there are others who share you feelings.

I think you don't play as well when you harbor bad feelings so you're not doing your present band much good if you stay. You have to watch out for the "grass is greener" or "frying pan to fire" issues, but that's the chance you take and hopefully you don't burn too many bridges in the transition.

I agree, weighing it all up, it's probably best to air your feelings. At least then it can be discussed, and even if everybody doesn't agree there's bound to be some who do, and you'll have spoken for them as well as yourself. It's well known nowadays that your feelings come through in your music, so you're right, if you're harbouring bad feelings, it'll get out one way or another in your music. Better to air your feelings round the table in the winter than have a build up of stuff that creeps out in the music when you're half way through your programme at the Worlds!!!!That way you'll be freer to concentrate on the music and the job in hand. And I agree if you do express your feelings and they're not taken on board or you don't feel you can stay with what you're in, then you're a round shape in a square hole so look for a space you can fit better into. Better for you and better for the space!!!:bow: